Elemental Blast vs Primal Elementalist
Back when Mists was first released I was very keen on Primal Elementalist. I liked the art update for starters, but ended up switching to Elemental Blast to eek out a few more points of DPS.
6 months later and I've switched back to Primal Elementalist because of the buffs and I have to say... I miss Elemental Blast. How do you guys feel about the differences?
I love elemental blast, i'm hoping that EoE + EB will remain the highest dps combination, and that we only have to use primal elementalist for fights where we can't get as good usage out of Elemental Blast.
I hope they bake elemental blast into the elemental spec for next expansion/5.4.
It's a discussion I had with a few of my guild mates back when I saw the buffs for Prime Elementalist being announced on the PTR: how much of a dps difference can you justify for yourself before you swap to a spec or talent that is less fun. It's a problem for many dps classes. Our mage prefers to play fire, but was pushed by the raid towards arcane even though he did not really enjoy it. Our dps warrior played arms at a very high lvl throughout dragonsoul, but did not enjoy fury as much in early MoP progression and eventually lost interested/motivation and left the game. I have considered rerolling warlock multiple times, but I'd rather quit raiding than having to play demo.
The general consensus in my guild was that pures are expected to play the best spec possible as soon as there is a 5%+ difference, even at the cost of enjoyment/fun (not a guild rule, just the opinion of individual members). I felt like they had much more sympathy for a hybrid taking a non optimal talent for the sake of fun. And I haven't found an explanation for that yet.
To me playing without elemental blast feels like I gimp myself, even though the numbers might prove me wrong. It might be muscle memory since I got so used pressing that F key to fire off ele blast, but I made a fair deal with myself. I play with elemental blast as long as there is not a clear reason to play with PE (like a nuke phase on windlord heroic for example). Which does not make a whole lot of sense because I would drop 200k without thinking on an item that gives me a 0.3% dps increase on the BMAH.
To illustrate it with an example: in the first and second MSV heroic reset we wiped on garajal heroic due to enrage. In that situation it's simply unacceptable to allow anyone in the raid playing a non optimal spec. But on a fight where you are wiping due to execution, I can justify for myself playing with a talent that might be non optimal, but still within a 1-3% range, simply because I enjoy it more.
I prefer elemental blast because I feel like the spec is much more interesting with the extra rotational spell. I agree with the sentiment that it would be a nice baseline spell and with luck they will make that change some day. I will probably stubbornly stick with EB in most cases even if PE sims higher, unless the difference is substantial.
Incidentally, from a design standpoint, I feel like elemental blast should be the highest theoretical dps pick for that talent tier since it is the most difficult to use. Similar to the way they seem to want Demonic Sacrifice for warlocks to be a little behind the other talents that take a little more effort to maximize.
Like Binkenstein I was excited for Primal Elementalist (but disappointed they weren't permanent and still leashed to the totem), but since I'm not raiding seriously this expansion I never had the need to try Elemental Blast.
Unlike the other replies here I'm desperate to cut as many buttons from my rotation as possible, so EB (and AS and EM) are huge turn offs. Although if I were competitive then I'd likely have had gone EB at some point to get those few extra points of DPS, I'm not sure it would've changed my opinion of the spell, but its certainly possible.
It actually alarms me how many shaman hope that EB will straight up trump PE, rather than just being the same or very close. Is that not enough incentive to use your preferred spell? I can sort of understand wanting to feel rewarded for managing a more difficult to use ability, but surely freedom of choice is more important.
i really like the rotation without EB
...and even in 5.1 where EB was ahead I still sticked to PE, as it is more fun for me to play...i was able to do decent dps and that was fine.
for 5.2 i am quite excited that PE got the buff and I will stay with it. (together with EotE)
with this combination i am quite mobile and through a slightly "easier" rotation I can focus on things that go on around me much better
Last edited by komani; 12-03-2013 at 08:51 AM.
I prefer PE myself,
you are much more mobile in combination with the Unleashed Lightning Glyph.
My rotation feel empty without EB. I went EB / EotE on Jin'Rokh and then PE / EM on Horrison and just set the elemental on the boss but i just didnt find it as compelling without having EB in the rotation, I will do everything in my power to stick with it
im still secretly hoping i can go with EB on low movement fights and UF on high movement fights with mastery reforges to get the most from my gear, but Bink says UF is looking poor regardless of movement
Like Zenga, if we arent wiping to enrage and i am performing competatively I will likely stick with EB unless PE as a definate advantage
I raided all of last tier with PE and am glad for the change. I never enjoyed EB. As the DPS gain was minimal, I stayed with what I knew best. I had no complaints from the guild considering I still ranked top 100 for almost all fights.
Just because a spec/talent is better than another, if someone is capable of playing the "unoptimal" spec at its highest capability, they may as well stick with it. Especially if they'd do worse with the "optimal" one.
This may not be the "progression"/"hardcore" mindset, but it still got us through the tier. 16/16H.
I had EB from the start and the one fight I went PE I really missed having EB as part of my rotation. The only fight where I intend on going PE every time is Durumu for movement purposes. We are starting heroics this week so perhaps my feelings will change but for now I'll be EB+EotE on every fight except Durumu.
It's interesting to see that we're pretty evenly split so far. I guess Blizzard is doing something right for that tier as far as talent choice goes as long as they can keep them roughly equal.
we are 2 elem in the guild with the same dps in 5.1 as soon as 5.2 hit i tested all alternatives to eb and so far it seems that em+pe+glyph of FE is the best then the AS+PE and last the EB+EoE
As others have said, i really like PE over EB cause of the mobility of.the.spec. having to stuttterstep for two different spells makes it hard.to keep a mobile rotation
I'am running PE over EB now. Throne of Thunder got many fight where iam feeling more comfortable with PE.
According to EotE or EM, i hate all those Hasteshit where i get below GCD with LvB.
May be they should get rid of EotE, cause of its pure nature. Passiv, much RNG (6% if remember right) ...
And Yeah i miss EB much, although it was a simple 12s CD Cast.
Originally Posted by Haarne
I wish Unleashed Fury would get more attention. I think that if it did competitive damage, it could be a fun and challenging rotation. I use it when I'm not raiding. I love the personal utility I get questing and imbue switching.
I really liked the idea of PE when it was first announced. Even though EB simmed higher i still stuck with PE (never had any dps issues on guild meters or WoL ranking). Since i never really got into EB; i can't say the rotation is missing anything from my point of view. PE to me feels great, and the fact that they buffed it just makes my justification for taking it even better!
The only issue i'm currently having is choosing between EM or EOTE. Fights where we hero off the bat makes EM feel a bit off.
I kept both dps specs, PE and EB and switched depending on fights. For the most part I prefer EB because it's a consistent dps increase that scales well to any length fight. The effectiveness of PE is too much a function of fight length and cooldown juggling for me.
My rotation feels odd just using lightning bolt filler, I honestly prefer Elemental blast because of that. Most of the ToT fights I've been trying out PE and its just not the same.
I don't really like Elemental Blast. I like the idea of "a spell" in that slot, but EB just feels like a muticolor Lightning Bolt. Same cast time, slightly higher priority, but still below almost everything else. I agree that the rotation is pretty dull with PE, but I don't find Elemental Blast to be any more compelling.
The one thing I do like about running PE is it gives us access to another survival tool. While The Primal EARTH Elemental is a DPS increase to have him attacking, it is nice to have his shield available if you need another survival tool.
The biggest thing I don't like about PE is that it doesn't scale with my favorite secondary stat, Mastery, and with our 4pc benefitting the most from it it makes the talent very awkward.